We're having some good sport with a Conservative in Croydon. Classic example of psychological denial and projection, so well worth a case history. When he spotted what we are saying with our policy "landowners are the world's biggest benefits scroungers", the trolling attacks started. We've hit the forbidden spot inside his mind.
I saw him coming at the beginning of the campaign, so have set up bait on several occasions, which has been duly taken hook line and sinker. Yeah we've done this a 1000 times. Useful research.
Dr Wrigley asked him at the count last night where he thinks money comes from. "The State?" So is clueless. Clearly this is the first time he's heard about our policy.
He's refusing to meet up for serious dialogue and when he recognised he'd been rumbled stopped making his tweets public but continues to troll out several tweets in a row, always attacking straw men. Lets see where it goes. Here's the latest. He's insisting I answer his straw men so I'll comply and let's watch how he buries himself.
As always we'd like to help him change his mind on the way. He now possesses forbidden knowledge. Its just matter of time.
This blog that attacks me for trolling ironically is trolling itself. I asked a series of substantive questions and you have still yet to answer them including:ReplyDelete
1. Your position extrapolated nationally could lead to a massive decrease in tax income, jeopardising public services. (https://twitter.com/MarioCreatura/status/273539214652624896)
2. No incentive to earn high/aspire to own property for fear of high taxation would cripple aspiration, enterprise and economy. (https://twitter.com/MarioCreatura/status/273539424082608130)
3. The wealthy 10% who fund 56% of public services would flee just like the French are fleeing currently under Hollande['s 75% tax rate]. (https://twitter.com/MarioCreatura/status/273539214652624896)
You also failed to account for Dr Wrigley's argument that to tempt citizens into this model you'd create billions of pounds in national debt to finance the covenant that would make this theoretical model work. This is unworkable politically and economically.
I'm not a troll. You failed to answer my questions on a public forum. Knowledge should be shared, discussed and disagreed on. You shouldn't throw your toys out of the pram as a result of either crushing electoral defeat or a few simple inquisitive points.
Best wishes for the future,
as an outsider (Literally; I'm from Bristol) but I must admit a somewhat biased perspective (I'm 26 and earn well above average wage, but can still only just afford rent payments on a house that has leaking chimney stacks and mould issues, and therefore cannot afford to save much for a deposit, even if I did want to buy into this massively overinflated market) issues 1 & 2 run directly opposite to each other:
1. "Oh no, there's not enough tax!"
2. "Oh no, there's too much tax!"
As for point 3, I would cheer. The glut of land that would be released onto the market if that did happen may bring down property values to something nearing sensible!
Possibly a bit too much bile there but I think this approaches the views of a lot of people in much worse positions than mine.
No incentive to earn high/aspire to own property for fear of high taxation would cripple aspiration, enterprise and economy.Delete
That has to be the most ridiculous argument ever invented. First of all, if the only incentive to work and create, were to eventually own a stream of rental(actual or imputed) income, subsidized by other people's taxes, you're pretty much screwed from the outset.
Now if by that you mean people's natural aspiration to own an actual Home, how about looking into policies such as moving taxation away from people acting on their aspirations, actually earning and income, creating stuff, building homes, onto the rental value of land?
In Hong-Kong, *all* land is leased from the state, which gets a significant amount of it's state budget from that rental income. Has this killed aspirations to earn and create enterprises? Ofcourse not. Hong-Kong actually has a thriving economy, how's the UK going?
This is just regurgitation of a Tory narrative that was invented to maintain the support of the continued untaxed stream of income awarded to owners of land.
The wealthy 10% who fund 56% of public services would flee just like the French are fleeing currently under Hollande['s 75% tax rate].Delete
You are implying that "the wealthy" get their income exclusively from passively receiving income from land, aren't they the ones who are investing and earning capital income from actual production, which the YPP is suggesting to eventually abolish...?
Sorry "abolish taxation of", not abolish "investing and earning capital income" :)Delete
Kj, don't worry. What you meant was clear from the context :bDelete
1. A conservative in favour of public services? Are you sure you're not a socialist?ReplyDelete
2. Taxation would be high only if the land value tax was high - and if it was then it would likely be worth paying as it would be on account of the benefits the location has to offer.
3. It is not the wealthy that matter as much as those who create wealth. Those who create wealth would have no reason to flee the UK with the introduction of LVT.
In terms of creating billions of pounds in national debt, what is your rationale for concluding that? It would not increase borrowing - just as quantitative easing does not increase borrowing :-)
Folks. These are all the classic KLN's we hear and answer daily. All have been answered and clarified a 1000 times so its not a technical problem. Its pure psychology. The man needs help understanding his own mind which evidently is in a very dark place.ReplyDelete
We call this "seeking infinite evidence". See Mr Wadsworth's superb blog for full exposition of this 250 times over. Wonderful stuff.
The hope is that he will change his mind and start contributing productively and positively to the surrounding community.
Remembering at all times that nothing you say will ever be conceded by him until he makes that change. And attacking straw men is the only strategy he will use until then. And turning every point of certainty back on you playground style. The darkness inside him hoping that most people will give up. And the public on the sidelines without time to analyse the simple facts will believe it. Its fascinating psychology.
BTW I have spoken to 'friends' of Mr Creature and they tell me he prides himself in being Croydon's number one troll.
I could see him a mile off so took it on board to try to help him and provide a case history. As he only makes a stand online he is anonymous to all intents.
I've offered to meet up and discuss this with him 4 times now. Lets try and help him come out of his shell.
I've also asked several times to make clear his strongest objection rather than trolling several at a time. Am still waiting.
This whole process is what the RSI calls a 'theological audit'.
Keep up the good work.
BW, Kj, good responses, thanks.ReplyDelete
CS, ta for response re deficit. The claim is absolute nonsense, and it is his own government which is deficit spending like mad to keep the banks and landowners happy. YPP would cross those people straight off the taxpayer funded Xmas list, which would probably eliminate the deficit anyway.